ISEs3 Ep15: Danny Wasserman - Gong! Tableau and Databricks

Erich Starrett: 00:00:00

Hello everyone.

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And welcome to inside sales enablement,

season three enablement history.

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And in our studios today, I think

might be one of the few human beings

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I've met on planet earth that can out

caffeinate me , I just had a chance

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to see Danny Wasserman live and in

person at digital now in Chicagoland.

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And he put on a show

that was a sight to see.

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Such an amazing career that he's

had in and around enablement.

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So many hooks into the things that.

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I believe in and know that enablement

can be, he epitomizes and shared a

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lot of the peak behind the scenes.

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He and Nate Vogel have been following

each other around for a minute.

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That goes back to Tableau where he

did everything from sales readiness,

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To being the global sales methodology,

lead strategist, and then headed over

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to Gong where he was ultimately the

director of go to market enablement.

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So he's, he's got some killer street

cred and now he's taken on a new

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adventure at Databricks, which you

might've heard of, they're doing

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quite well now with Danny on board.

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About four months under his belt.

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Danny Wasserman: Yeah, the only

thing that I need to, for the record,

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correct is, you know, following

Nate Vogel is an accurate statement.

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Nate Vogel following me would

be an inaccurate statement.

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That guy leads from the front.

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There's nothing about either my style or

my demeanor that would inspire someone

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like Nate to want to follow me, but I

could very much vouch for the fact that I

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stand on the shoulders of giants, both on

Nate's shoulders, but then all the logos.

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You just mentioned and for the momentum

and the buzz and the hype and cache

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around Databricks right now, I can

claim absolutely zero credit for.

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So just lucky, lucky to be a part of that.

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Erich Starrett: So Danny, we've

got you here in the studio.

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I'm curious with someone with that

kind of a history with those kinds

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of logos sales enablement, when

did you first hear those two words?

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What do they mean to you?

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Danny Wasserman: Yeah, so I had

always worked in startups early stage.

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I've been a small company guy through and

through, and I was a co founder of one.

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I had tried my luck at a few others, and

my first taste of what at the time felt

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humongous was Tableau, when I joined back

in: 2015

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The IPO had just recently happened,

and that was my taste of enablement

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was going through a onboarding

program that was spearheaded by the

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truly incomparable Sarah Bedwell.

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Another person who deserves to

be enshrined in the great halls

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of enablement professionals.

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I think Sarah stood head and shoulders

above anyone else that I had experienced

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in a sales training capacity.

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And I think for the next two

years, I'll be honest, I really

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thumbed my nose at the profession.

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I think that I put my

head down as a seller.

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I was on a warpath as a

gunner, as an alpha, as an

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utterly neurotic control freak.

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Formulaically, sales was a perfect

place for me because there was no

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voice telling me to stop working.

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And I was positively reinforced

from being that tenacious in

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what I achieved and what I made.

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And along the way, I kept feeling

like, God, I think I have a better

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hold and handle on how to be successful

in this profession than the counsel

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and the advice I'm getting in

the beginning of my sales career.

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It's hard because you want to

take in all these opinions and

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some of those can be competing.

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Some of those can be contradictory.

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There can be conflict in

what you're being told to do.

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And you want to pay respect and

homage to supposedly the authorities

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on what you should be doing.

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And I just found while Sarah being the

exception, most enablement I was getting

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felt pretty fluffy or self evident.

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And I think as such, enablement amongst

some of us in sales was pretty poor.

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And stigma stigmas follow people.

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And I think the adage, right, those

who can't do, those who can't teach.

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And I say that somewhat tongue in cheek

because that haunted me as I continue to

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find success in sales and was being asked

to moonlight as a facilitator for one

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course in our onboarding for new hires.

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And I loved it.

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I loved it so much.

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I've always wanted to be a teacher,

but I knew a teacher's salary Was

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never going to foot the bill for

my lifestyle or some obligations.

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I felt compelled to meet namely

Sending kids to college debt free.

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So for years, I was so reluctant to

even entertain a call from nate But

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as time went on I realized wow, okay.

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Here's this guy.

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I think he's a little You know different

in his approach to how he does this.

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He's so savvy with people And this was

sort of a long You Drawn out courtship

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between him and I so much so that

the tipping point truly the reckoning

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Was at month end I was in a knockdown

drag out fight with my best friend

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on the sales team over a thousand

dollar spiff and I was Slandering

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his name cursing everything about him

because he beat me in the 11th hour.

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He's still a sheisty mother

But no i'm just kidding.

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I remember driving home and I remember

thinking this isn't who I want to be A

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thousand dollars should not get in the

way of any relationship, let alone mutate

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me into this person I don't want to be.

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And that's really when I think the

tables turned and the scales flipped.

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And I started seriously entertaining

this with Nate and that was what eight,

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10 years ago, three companies ago.

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Erich Starrett: I do enablement, right?

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, that's such a great story.

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And look, look where and, and

how visible you are today.

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And so speaking of enablement becoming

more visible and I'll say getting our

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act together, the Sales Enablement

Society, now Revenue Enablement Society,

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when or did the Sales Enablement

Society come into play for you?

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Danny Wasserman: I think it's funny that

you talk about, Oh my God, my dirty

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little secret is that I'm an enablement.

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Dude.

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You couldn't have captured the

essence of how I felt about being

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a former seller who had sort of

taken a bite of the forbidden fruit.

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And people actually cautioned me

before I left like, dude, no one's

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gonna take you seriously anymore.

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You're out of the clubhouse.

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You're out of the locker room, right?

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You're just a consultant now.

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And there were definitely times I

felt that, but I think it was because

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of my experience as a former seller.

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It was whether it was the haunting

fear of being pegged that way was

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either both motivating or terrifying

that I never want to get anywhere

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close to being pegged that way.

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So I came out swinging.

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I came out with spice.

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I came out with, I think pretty, I'll

use the word again, tenacious approach

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to do enablement as if I was still

a seller, what would captivate me?

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And think having a pretty ruthless bar for

any content that was associated with my

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name had to be ruthless I mean not just

riveting but you wanted to be dripping

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on every last word and it was backed

by citations and science and numbers.

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And to your point now we're having

our time in the sun Because of some of

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the tech that's come out in the last

few years that gives us a leg to stand

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on So it wasn't always so hunky dory.

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I mean there was some doom and gloom and

enablement and if you didn't have a leader

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like nate who had the ear Of the king,

whether it was the CRO of leadership,

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it was a dogfight, an uphill battle to

garner a shred of mind share legitimacy.

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So again, when I say I stand on

the shoulders of giants, I was

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fortunate enough to be within

the cocoon of Mother Goose Vogel.

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And I think now the playing field has

been leveled thanks to tools like gong.

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Or again, I don't want to

be like the gong fanboy.

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Gong is one of many solutions

that give enablement a much more

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scientific backdrop to fall back on

the recommendations they're providing.

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But yeah, man, like only until

probably the last 24 months have

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I sort of proudly stood up and

banged my chest and said, yeah, I'm

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Enablement and this is freaking cool.

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Erich Starrett: It's like, it's a

biblical thing, but there's this

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whole conversion of Saul to Paul.

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I love how you went from sales

enablement sucks to I'm the king

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of the sales enablement world!

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And in fact, I loved your presentation,

fighting for your cabinet seat,

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everything you just said, like

that's so perfectly embodied.

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And it's a story I'm going to

be borrowing from shamelessly

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and giving you all the credit.

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But along the same lines, when the

sales enablement society was founded

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back in 2016, the hundred ish folks

that were there landed on three things.

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And the 1st 1 was that enablement is

not just talent enablement, but there

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are at least 4 flavors of it that they

started off from the ground floor,

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which were talent, of course, but then

messaging and marketing enablement.

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And administrative sales

ops, revenue operations.

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And pipeline enablement and they

broke those out into different because

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there are different strategic elements

and there are different parts of the

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internal executive suite and revenue

engine that you have to have that seat

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at the table in order to effectively be

able to enable, which was position two.

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In order for enablement to be

effective, it has to be run as a cross

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functional business within a business.

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And then the third, was that enablement.

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Hey, we're here in a room.

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We're putting a stake in the

ground this is a thing we're

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building a global society.

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What are we evolving from to?

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And, it was like, well, there are

CFOs, there are CIOs that evolved

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from, you know, smaller jobs.

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What about chief productivity officer?

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So the idea that we're elevating

the profession to something.

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Your presentation about fighting

for your cabinet seat seemed to be

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grounded in some of those concepts,

which of those resonate with you?

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Danny Wasserman: Yeah For sure, man.

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I think that even the audacious

aspiraitons from the onset of the

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society were day there will be a time

where we no longer think that a chief

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productivity officer in that role is

novel or that that would be atypical.

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But that becomes commonplace

as we legitimize the place

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for learning in the workplace.

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And I think that, as I

alluded to, I'd love to teach.

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You know, I spent my summers as a

camp counselor, then as a guide.

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So there's been this educational

component and bend to my life

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for as long as I've been working.

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And yet, we can all appreciate that

teachers are grossly underpaid.

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So if you have this passion to teach,

but also feel the burdens financially

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of what it means to live in today's

society, you can't pencil out those,

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you know, Those math equations.

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How I got to enablement was an accident,

but it was again, I, I talked to so

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many folks who are trying to get out

of sales because of any number of

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destructive forces that come with

that, the burnout, the anxiety, they're

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just no longer passionate about it.

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And everyone looks to enablement

because you're adjacent to revenue.

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So you tangentially feel

the excitement of that.

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But you don't have the weight of quota.

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And not to say that there isn't

piles that come with our job, too.

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Don't get me wrong, like, every job you

have to shovel so I don't want to, paint

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this as hunky dory, like, Oh, we've

made it to Oz or the Promised Land.

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I sit in the Garden of Eden,

Drinking Evian every day.

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That's not the case.

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But I do believe sometimes people

struggle with trusting the process.

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That if you're passionate about

what it is that You are doing the

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success and the opportunity, the

financial, maybe not leisure, but

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the depressurization of some of those

pressures will alleviate over time.

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So long as you continue to use your

passion as the barometer for how you make

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decisions, because you can't inherently

turn off that passion or excitement.

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That will presumably beget success,

which will then beget hopefully

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some of that sense of satisfaction.

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Back to your question about the society's

sort of inception and its pillars.

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Yeah, I think you have, different

personas within enablement that you

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think rather than it being a one size

fits all, that that helps at least

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shape specialization in the profession

that then yields more legitimacy.

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I think instead of four,

I think about it is three.

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There is a persona within the profession

that is a facilitator, someone who is

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a theatrical thespian because we've

all sat through presentations where

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it is worse than watching paint dry.

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And time is money for all of

us, but especially in sales.

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So you really appreciate someone

who can breathe, not just life, but

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excitement into what the hell it is

they're talking about in a riveting,

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compelling, captivating story.

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That skill set will set you apart,

even if it's not your own content.

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How do you as an actor, actress,

Bring that to the workplace.

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Could not have predicted that there would

be a time and a place and value for that.

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The second persona I would say, I think

you alluded to it, was sort of this

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more administrative or operational role.

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Enablement as you get bigger, take on

incredibly squirrely, rat's nest problems.

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And are you the type of person that

leaves no stone unturned and the

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granularity of the minutiae that you

want to obsess over so that all the

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trains Leave on time and that we're

under budget and finishing early.

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That's a really Necessary

sort of pm skill set.

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And the third I would say is more of

for anyone who's a godfather fan Is

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the tom hagen consigliere type, you

know You didn't stay in sales or sales

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leadership because you had to be front

and center But do you love pulling on

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strings as a chief of staff strategist?

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And I think somewhere in that third

persona, you blend a little bit of each

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of those other two, but I have seen people

make wildly successful careers out of just

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being niche in one of those three buckets.

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So when you were talking about, hey,

like enablement can't just be a paint

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by numbers, peanut butter smear.

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I think those are the types

of personas I advise people.

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What's going to fill your cup?

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What's going to unlock the best

parts of Erich or Danny or Jane

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Doe, and if any of those speak to

you, then trust in the process and

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follow your passions and enablement.

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Erich Starrett: Well, you've

definitely found your calling Danny.

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You can own a spotlight like no other,

and really appreciate you coming

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on the show to, share some of that

talent and wisdom with the audience.

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So, in october of last year, a

new historical milestone in that

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the Sales Enablement Society

shifted to revenue enablement.

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I'm curious, especially with the

logos you've represented, the

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passion you've had, the, I can't

even imagine how many enablement

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professionals you've interacted with.

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What does that shift mean if anything

mean to you in those words, sales

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enablement to revenue enablement.

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Danny Wasserman: I think it

speaks to a few things, right?

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With the pervasive shift to subscription,

You know, there's a lot of debate.

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Should there be a

customer success function?

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Should everyone own that?

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You know, Frank Slootman boldly came

out and said, why am I going to put all

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of the customer success on one person?

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And I think that revenue comes from

a variety of different angles and

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sort of stereotypically sales being

more of a newer incremental role.

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Revenue generating function and CS if

we use that genErichally speaking as a

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renewal function Well, all of those people

need to be better not because again,

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they're bad at their jobs But because

it's just so damn competitive and the

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pace of change is such blisteringly fast

That I would say Everyone can continue

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to up their game and we now have the

tools where you can capture your game

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footage, analyze it at scale no less as

opposed to in silos or in isolation of

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one individual and actually draw some

more scientific conclusions about how

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are we going to make everybody better.

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And so much of I think the interest in

being part of this tech scene is the

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upside of being an equity shareholder.

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We all have a vested interest in holding

ourselves every day to a higher bar.

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So moving out of sales to revenue, I

think, not only covers end to end that

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cycle, which also then includes, you

know, the niche specialization of the

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BDR, SDR, XDR function at the tip of

the spear with prospecting all the way

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end to end cradle to grave to renewal.

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It can't be a one size fits all.

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So I love that we're revenue.

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As part of my talk that you heard

at digital now, I also think that

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because of the tech that's specifically

geared at our world, the lines blur

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even further into operations, right?

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We were pretty discreet five,

six, however many years ago.

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Ops were the people that were

the analysts that told you what's

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happening underneath the hood.

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But they can never actually

capture how are things going?

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Or why are they going that way?

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Simply just more what's happening.

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And I think now when we talk about

sales enablement to revenue enablement,

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it's end to end cradle grave.

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All those personas plus the

ability to actually hold court.

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With not sales operations,

revenue operations.

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I think that same transition is taking

place on that side of the aisle.

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Erich Starrett: For those that, that

weren't there , this was, All through

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the lens, maybe you get a little bit

of a background on what you meant

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by fighting for your cabinet seat

and being in that room where it

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happened and how that room changed.

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What is that room where

enablement happened?

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What did it used to look like?

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What does it look like today?

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What should we be doing in the

present as enablement to get us there?

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Danny Wasserman: No doubt.

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I left sales because I was toying

with the idea of getting my MBA.

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: 00:18:11

Right.

295

: 00:18:12

And I thought what nobility comes

with an MBA from a school that

296

: 00:18:19

prides itself on having prestige.

297

: 00:18:21

And then I'll be happy.

298

: 00:18:22

And then I'll feel intelligent.

299

: 00:18:24

I didn't.

300

: 00:18:25

And I did sales for a while and I

looked and I said, I want to be in that

301

: 00:18:30

room that you're speaking of, Erich.

302

: 00:18:31

I want to be in the tent.

303

: 00:18:32

I want to see how strategy is hatched

or show me how the sausage is made.

304

: 00:18:36

And don't just show me

at some point in my life.

305

: 00:18:38

I want to.

306

: 00:18:39

I feel that my fingerprints are

all over that sausage, and that

307

: 00:18:43

sounded oddly , so forgive me.

308

: 00:18:45

But you get where I'm going.

309

: 00:18:46

Enablement was a way

for me to cut corners.

310

: 00:18:50

And get there faster and to try and

pony up to the people that do have a, I

311

: 00:18:56

think, really, you know, typical standard

seat in that entire process in the room.

312

: 00:19:01

And as time has gone on the margins

for error in any role have become

313

: 00:19:05

compressed to being razor thin.

314

: 00:19:08

And there's a stat that looks at.

315

: 00:19:10

The average tenure of a CRO in

today's day and age is 19 months.

316

: 00:19:14

So I hate to militarize what it is

that we do in sales because that

317

: 00:19:18

feels as cliche as calling it sports.

318

: 00:19:20

But yeah, we're battling

against competition.

319

: 00:19:23

So in prepping for my presentation, I

used the analogy of a sort of war cabinet.

320

: 00:19:29

Dating all the way back to the 1800s

where it was first used in England,

321

: 00:19:34

but it was first actually published

nd discussed in literature in: 1916

322

: 00:19:38

So, for those historians out

there, that's World War I.

323

: 00:19:42

And, Lloyd George, who was Prime

Minister at the time, was trying

324

: 00:19:46

to think about when there's so much

complexity in my job as Prime Minister.

325

: 00:19:52

I need some advisors.

326

: 00:19:53

I need counsel so I can

bounce ideas off of them.

327

: 00:19:56

And initially it was suggested

that he have a handful of advisors.

328

: 00:20:01

Let's start with three.

329

: 00:20:04

And very quickly, that burgeoned to being

unwieldy and out of control, where it got

330

: 00:20:09

as high as 23 people in his war cabinet.

331

: 00:20:13

You talk about being absolutely paralyzed

by the analysis and democracy of

332

: 00:20:19

maintaining some sort of understanding

of what 23 people are telling you.

333

: 00:20:22

It's impossible.

334

: 00:20:24

So, Churchill, famously, for acting

decisively and assertively, he looked

335

: 00:20:29

at that and said, This is bull....

336

: 00:20:30

So he brought it down to four.

337

: 00:20:33

And I think about, I want to

be in that cabinet war room.

338

: 00:20:38

I want my fingerprints on the sausage

, that we got to stick with that bit.

339

: 00:20:43

Now it's too good.

340

: 00:20:44

And if the equivalent.

341

: 00:20:47

In this analogy to Churchill is the CRO.

342

: 00:20:51

What am I doing to fight and using that

term operatively fight for my opinion

343

: 00:20:57

to rise above a lot of other noise.

344

: 00:20:59

And that's not me slandering or poo poo

what other people are attempting to do.

345

: 00:21:02

Everyone's intentions are pure.

346

: 00:21:04

But there's only so much mindshare.

347

: 00:21:06

There's only so much time.

348

: 00:21:08

There's only so much money to

invest in certain projects.

349

: 00:21:12

I got to fight to legitimize

what it is that I'm suggesting.

350

: 00:21:15

And I do think that being competitive

and as a former seller, that

351

: 00:21:18

has served me immeasurably well.

352

: 00:21:21

Because I think I bring that, where

I started in sales, that tenacity

353

: 00:21:26

to enablement, because if I'm not

fighting that hard for my cabinet seat

354

: 00:21:31

with whatever executive I'm trying

to maintain my sort of position with,

355

: 00:21:35

there's a dozen people behind me

that will absolutely eat my lunch.

356

: 00:21:39

Erich Starrett: Couldn't agree more.

357

: 00:21:40

I love the analogy right

down to the sausage making,

358

: 00:21:46

Danny Wasserman: Yes.

359

: 00:21:47

All of the sausage making is consensual.

360

: 00:21:49

No HR violations were committed

in making enablement strategy.

361

: 00:21:56

Erich Starrett: Right?

362

: 00:21:57

So some of the things you shared about

what got us here and what's going on

363

: 00:22:02

in the present, arguably, and a lot

of camps that won't get us there is.

364

: 00:22:07

The status quo.

365

: 00:22:09

Proposing the same things that repeat

themselves over and over again.

366

: 00:22:13

Do you have any present

day recommendations?

367

: 00:22:16

And then, we'll get to the future on

how some of these folks can maybe,

368

: 00:22:20

drop some knowledge bombs on how

maybe they can mix it up a little

369

: 00:22:23

bit and get outside of the box.

370

: 00:22:25

Danny Wasserman: The status quo is

warm, it's fuzzy, it's familiar.

371

: 00:22:29

Not to accuse anyone of being a one

trick pony, I think that it's only

372

: 00:22:33

natural psychologically that we would

feel shackled whether we realize it

373

: 00:22:37

or not, to what's worked in the past.

374

: 00:22:39

I'm guilty of that, right?

375

: 00:22:41

As the, sort of, sales methodology guy at

Tableau, I rolled out Corporate Visions,

376

: 00:22:45

and, I love them, but you talk about

what worked historically in enablement.

377

: 00:22:51

They have phenomenal thespians

who facilitate their content and

378

: 00:22:56

these aren't slouches either.

379

: 00:22:57

They're brilliant people.

380

: 00:22:59

There's a lot of intelligence in how

you bring that content to life and

381

: 00:23:03

it can all withstand the pushback and

the scrutiny and the skepticism of the

382

: 00:23:06

most cynical and grizzled of sellers.

383

: 00:23:09

So they've got a great product and that

worked really well when we first got

384

: 00:23:13

a taste of it and the viral nature in

which it spread was largely based and

385

: 00:23:18

predicated on the success of how they

brought that content to life, and how

386

: 00:23:23

it was able to go from a pilot of 40

people to eventually over three years,

387

: 00:23:28

taking that to 1600 people globally

was again how we brought that to life.

388

: 00:23:34

So then transitioning to gong

and sort of saying, we have

389

: 00:23:37

this awesome thing that we did.

390

: 00:23:39

Let's apply it and drop it in here, right?

391

: 00:23:42

There was a lot of, well, who the hell

are you new guy who just got to Gong?

392

: 00:23:46

You have no idea what our DNA makeup is.

393

: 00:23:48

You have no idea what's

worked in the past.

394

: 00:23:50

On what basis or grounds can

you make that suggestion?

395

: 00:23:54

There was a lot of, you know, outsider

looking in, hypothesizing, we think we've

396

: 00:24:00

got your silver bullet that you need.

397

: 00:24:02

There wasn't a lot of, I would say,

welcomed reception to that initially.

398

: 00:24:06

So if I was going to rest on my

laurels and just sort of force

399

: 00:24:11

CVI down Gong's throat, it would

not have been a tasty meal.

400

: 00:24:16

And I think what it took was evolving

when I got there to really analyzing their

401

: 00:24:22

status quo with their own technology to,

I think, not introduce a new theory that

402

: 00:24:29

their status quo was faltering, but put

numbers to it and then in a guerrilla

403

: 00:24:34

kind of way have pockets of people that

were pressure testing my hypothesis with

404

: 00:24:40

CVI's why change to create a measurable,

concrete, distinguishable Contrast,

405

: 00:24:47

which earned me the right to then go

and float this in front of the CRO.

406

: 00:24:51

That it wasn't a he said,

she said, hey, just trust me.

407

: 00:24:54

I've done this before, but it

was like, here's the numbers.

408

: 00:24:56

We have meaningful signals

from this pilot of CVI.

409

: 00:24:59

Are you willing to go all in and all

in with the understanding that Gong

410

: 00:25:04

will hold me and CVI accountable.

411

: 00:25:06

And I think that that's a really important

distinction, Erichh, that we also need

412

: 00:25:10

to really pay tribute to, which is Five,

ten years ago, CVI would come in with

413

: 00:25:16

their amazing thespian facilitators,

or Challenger would do the same, or

414

: 00:25:19

Miller Hyman, or Richardson, or whoever,

and you would pay a king's ransom to

415

: 00:25:24

have them roll it out, and then they

would vanish with no accountability.

416

: 00:25:29

And what's awesome is, yes, they are

all still that phenomenal and theatrical

417

: 00:25:33

and fantastic and facilitating, but

Gong, or whoever you're using for

418

: 00:25:38

your nut sales intelligence, Or your

conversation intelligence, but your

419

: 00:25:41

revenue intelligence should be what

actually holds them accountable if you're

420

: 00:25:45

signing a multi year contract with them.

421

: 00:25:48

If you're seeing that adoption

is faltering, why is that?

422

: 00:25:52

Is that because your people

just need to be reinforced?

423

: 00:25:55

Or are people actually using it,

they are adopting it, but it's

424

: 00:25:57

tanking your win rates, or it's

decelerating your sales cycles?

425

: 00:26:01

Shame on them, whichever

IP vendor you went with.

426

: 00:26:04

And now it can't be a, he said,

she said, you've got the numbers

427

: 00:26:07

from your revenue intelligence tech

stack to tell that to them to either

428

: 00:26:10

demand a discount or even a refund.

429

: 00:26:13

Erich Starrett: So as we shift to the

future, it sounds like you see a big

430

: 00:26:17

opportunity for this culmination of

where the enablement profession meets

431

: 00:26:24

technology, which I've heard these two

letters, a, I, a lot recently what,

432

: 00:26:30

what does that future look like to you?

433

: 00:26:32

Danny Wasserman: Yeah.

434

: 00:26:33

So I'm contending with that

in my own skillset right

435

: 00:26:37

now is how do I reckon with.

436

: 00:26:40

Is AI displacing me?

437

: 00:26:41

And that's a real, I'll

use the word, fear.

438

: 00:26:45

Erich Starrett: Yeah.

439

: 00:26:45

Danny Wasserman: I can distinctly

remember exactly where I'm sitting

440

: 00:26:48

when I hear Kyle Healy, who's the SVP

of Enablement at a insurance company.

441

: 00:26:54

So Kyle, if you're listening,

thanks again for this.

442

: 00:26:56

I quote you all the time.

443

: 00:26:57

He said, When we think about AI's

place in our profession, do you

444

: 00:27:01

want to embrace that technology

like Iron Man, or do you want to

445

: 00:27:05

attempt to resist it like Terminator?

446

: 00:27:09

And we all know how that ended.

447

: 00:27:11

And where I'm going is I cornered a

function with an enablement very quickly

448

: 00:27:18

as a former seller that had everything

to do with how do you whip through

449

: 00:27:21

an account plan research process with

both surgical precision and efficiency,

450

: 00:27:28

because those can be really paradoxical.

451

: 00:27:30

And I came up with my own methodology

that I've trained hundreds,

452

: 00:27:33

not thousands of sellers on.

453

: 00:27:35

How to do that at scale.

454

: 00:27:37

And yeah, it's not, I would

say, in any way revolutionary.

455

: 00:27:40

It's going to all the usual

suspects of 10Ks and LinkedIn and

456

: 00:27:43

whatnot, but I've done it enough

times to know that it holds water.

457

: 00:27:47

And yet, AI is very quickly making

that methodology obsolete because you

458

: 00:27:52

can go to Databugger or Finlistics.

459

: 00:27:54

Or LinkedIn sales navigator has the

account IQ now that gives you a baseline

460

: 00:28:00

understanding of coming up with what is

the point of view, the distillate, the

461

: 00:28:04

synthesis from your account plan research.

462

: 00:28:07

A lot of job security and competency

that I brought was all tied

463

: 00:28:11

up in me teaching this course.

464

: 00:28:13

For years and I need to get to

a place where I'm not trying to

465

: 00:28:17

bury my head in the sand from all

these tools that are coming up

466

: 00:28:20

automatically with points of views.

467

: 00:28:23

I need to figure out where do

those fall short and how can my

468

: 00:28:27

human oversight supplement and

compliment what they provide.

469

: 00:28:34

I'm not irrelevant.

470

: 00:28:35

I'm not obsolete.

471

: 00:28:37

But if I refuse to actually study

what's out there to know then, how to

472

: 00:28:42

tune with the human oversight or the

finesse, the last mile of that journey.

473

: 00:28:48

Then yeah, I think I've already forfeited.

474

: 00:28:51

Because sooner or later, they're

just gonna get better and better.

475

: 00:28:53

If I'm not staying current with what's out

there, then my one trick pony status quo

476

: 00:28:59

of today will make me a victim tomorrow,

477

: 00:29:03

Erich Starrett: Danny, your pony

has a million, three tricks.

478

: 00:29:06

What's this one trick stuff, but

I love, I love what you shared.

479

: 00:29:12

And one of the kind of hashtags that

has evolved in my mind is AI curious,

480

: 00:29:20

human enthusiast, and it's, it's

along lines of what you just shared.

481

: 00:29:25

I would argue there's no cloning Danny.

482

: 00:29:27

That's for sure.

483

: 00:29:29

And I see such a great opportunity

as I hear you saying to shift the

484

: 00:29:36

administrivia to the AI, but lean into

your given gifting and let that shine.

485

: 00:29:44

Be it in the spotlight or be it

synthesizing the synthesis, right?

486

: 00:29:49

There still is that human Element.

487

: 00:29:52

So maybe share on a final note,

wherever you'd like to land the plane.

488

: 00:29:58

What do you see through that vein?

489

: 00:30:01

What is your encouragement

for this listening audience?

490

: 00:30:06

If you, my friends want to be part of

the elevation of sales enablement with

491

: 00:30:12

all of the additional tool set you have.

492

: 00:30:15

And if you also want to be in the

room where it happens, what's next?

493

: 00:30:21

Danny Wasserman: Man.

494

: 00:30:22

Oh, what's a another

episode right there, dude?

495

: 00:30:25

Erich Starrett: Well, let's do it!

496

: 00:30:26

Here's the trailer.

497

: 00:30:27

Danny Wasserman: exactly.

498

: 00:30:28

I think that where my head goes,

sort of, if you want to be in the

499

: 00:30:32

room and you're excited about where

we're elevating collectively as a

500

: 00:30:38

profession, elevating the notion of

enablement, I want to leave people with

501

: 00:30:42

this idea that whether it's in sales.

502

: 00:30:45

Or whether it's in CS or it's in

enablement, you cannot trivialize

503

: 00:30:49

or overstate the importance of the

intersection between hospitality

504

: 00:30:56

and the world of business.

505

: 00:30:58

And I think this is sort of a,

perhaps curve ball that I'm throwing

506

: 00:31:02

you, but stick with me here.

507

: 00:31:04

One of the like virtuoso, I

would say guiding voices in my

508

: 00:31:10

entire career, is Danny Meyer.

509

: 00:31:13

Danny Meyer if you don't know the name

is ordinarily thought to be the most

510

: 00:31:17

successful American restaurateur in

our country's history and his first

511

: 00:31:22

restaurant in New York City was Union

Square Cafe in: 1987

512

: 00:31:27

on to open dozens of restaurants most of

which Have when he first cut his teeth

513

: 00:31:32

Anchored more into the fine dining space.

514

: 00:31:34

And if you looked at the top

10 restaurants in New York City

515

: 00:31:37

each year, you would ordinarily

see at least a handful that were

516

: 00:31:41

within Danny's restaurant group.

517

: 00:31:43

But what really made him a, at

this point now, billionaire is

518

: 00:31:46

that he also started Shake Shack.

519

: 00:31:49

So we all know that as a global brand,

but that's not where he started.

520

: 00:31:53

Why think about referencing

Danny with where this is going

521

: 00:31:56

is it was so counterintuitive.

522

: 00:31:59

I like that word a lot because I

think that it's those counterintuitive

523

: 00:32:02

moments and enablement.

524

: 00:32:04

I can remember counterintuitive lessons

or parables that CVI would tell you that

525

: 00:32:08

whoa, oh my God, that's so illuminating.

526

: 00:32:11

Danny looked at how hospitality was run

that generally at that point in time in

527

: 00:32:16

history, it placed employees at the lowest

rung on the ladder for prioritization,

528

: 00:32:23

and it put investors and then customers

and then vendors ahead of them.

529

: 00:32:28

He said, that's bull!

530

: 00:32:30

We should prioritize our employees first,

and then everything else will follow that.

531

: 00:32:35

If our employees feel loved and feel

valued, then not to again, quote,

532

: 00:32:40

trickle down economics, but then.

533

: 00:32:42

Sort of this virtuous enlightened

hospitality will unfold.

534

: 00:32:47

And where I'm trying to land the plane

is that in enablement, I do believe

535

: 00:32:52

that this is a service business.

536

: 00:32:53

And you could make the argument,

but sales and customer success,

537

: 00:32:56

and like ops, it's all service.

538

: 00:32:57

Sure, but genuinely what

enablement provides is service.

539

: 00:33:03

And I think if you feel that

passionately, if you feel that

540

: 00:33:05

authentically and genuinely, the

beneficiaries of what it is that

541

: 00:33:09

you're providing will also sense that.

542

: 00:33:12

That it's not lip service, it's

not insincere, but also you will

543

: 00:33:16

not allow or tolerate yourself

to serve a mediocre product.

544

: 00:33:21

And I think that there's a

lot of mediocrity out there.

545

: 00:33:26

And you could say, Oh man, why

would I ever want to join that?

546

: 00:33:30

Or you could say, if that's the

baseline in the bar, there are lots

547

: 00:33:34

of us that are trying to elevate.

548

: 00:33:35

And that's not an accusation.

549

: 00:33:37

. Like I just think that historically

we haven't been given the tools or

550

: 00:33:40

the mindset or the legitimacy to

actually want to take huge pride

551

: 00:33:47

in what it is that we're doing.

552

: 00:33:48

And again, I think that that's

probably where I want to land.

553

: 00:33:51

Do you feel what Danny refers to

in his book, setting the table?

554

: 00:33:54

In addition to having your IQ, your

intellectual quotient, do you have what

555

: 00:33:59

he calls HQ and hospitality quotient?

556

: 00:34:03

You talk about the unexpected, never

in the tea leaves that I see as part of

557

: 00:34:08

this job, that my affinity for hosting

A dinner party would then translate to

558

: 00:34:13

hosting an off site and what that has

done That's not in the conventional job

559

: 00:34:19

description of enablement, but because

we're in the service business That has

560

: 00:34:22

also elevated me to being in the room

and that those skills that maybe you

561

: 00:34:27

trivialize All of a sudden are like whoa,

but actually That is a very relevant,

562

: 00:34:33

applicable skillset that comes in this

whole mishmash that is enablement as well.

563

: 00:34:39

So Erich, I don't know if that's where

you want to go, but that's where at

564

: 00:34:41

least attempted to crash the plane.

565

: 00:34:44

Erich Starrett: I, that, that

plane is flying higher than ever.

566

: 00:34:47

I , thank you so much, Danny.

567

: 00:34:48

I know you're crazy busy.

568

: 00:34:49

Good luck on your world tour.

569

: 00:34:51

You're about to jump back in on, and

thank you for all that you've done and

570

: 00:34:55

continue to do to elevate the profession

and to share your passion and your

571

: 00:35:00

service, like you were just sharing.

572

: 00:35:02

It does not surprise me at all that you

have a penchant for throwing a dinner

573

: 00:35:06

party and I'd love to be at one, one day.

574

: 00:35:09

I'll even hop on one of those planes.

575

: 00:35:11

So thanks again for your time, Danny.

576

: 00:35:13

Danny Wasserman: This was great.

577

: 00:35:14

Thanks, Erich!

578

: 00:35:14

Erich

579

: 00:35:14

Erich Starrett: Awesome.

580

: 00:35:15

My pleasure, brother.